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What if God Evolved
January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm
(This post was last modified: January 12, 2009 at 10:12 pm by FutureAndAHope.)
I often hear the argument that it is illogical that God exists. However this is not the case, it is only the case if God is some how a magical force that created every thing from nothing.
If you are an evolutionist you are actually stating it is possible that God does exist. Evolution is a lower form taking on a higher form of complexity. What if God evolved on a firey radioactive planet, or has evolved a higher state than our own by which he has mastered technologies capable of creating and destroying planets, and populating them at His own will. To such an extent that he has enthroned himself as God. He has discovered how to create life, even eternal beings. Beings he has subjected to His laws and will. A God who will not tolerate rebellion against his will, and will punish in eternal fire. A God who does not desire any one perish by such an act, but rather would have each one turn in surrender to his offer of eternal forgiveness. Forgiveness found only in the crucifiction of his own self, as an example of forgiveness; saying in prayer as an example for us "Father forgive them for they do not know what they are doing", as he was being nailed through. The just crucified for the and in-place of the unjust. A God who does what ever he sees fit with his things.
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 12, 2009 at 11:17 pm
While this would make a cool science fiction story I don't tend to say that there is just no evidence for your god. I have not seen evidence for ANY god of any make or form with the exeption of a god that does nothing at all.
Also a being that evolved naturally would be powerful indeed but, not godly I don't think. Because if you could eventually evolve into a god then monotheisim would be laughable (Ok ok, MORE laughable)because it would just be the next step. Every species would eventually evolve into this acsended state eventually, assuming it survives.
Even if for the sake of discussion we assumed everything you said was true, thsi god would be nothing nore than an asshat. Theres ZERO reason to send people to eternal hellfire but he specifically does it by his own choice. This is NOT a being you should want to worship, this is a slave driver, a dictator and a bully.
In fact I would not worship or serve this god for very similar reasons to why I would never worship or serve your god.
I think I'll quote Richard Dawkins in describing both, since you're pretty clearly trying to put a possible beggining to your god: "a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sado-masochistic, capriciously malevolent bully". - Richard Dawkins
So, despite there still being nothing to support a god that evolved naturally he's still just a little kid over an ant hill with a big magnifying glass just like the gods of today. And the only hope that this theory would bring, if it had a chance at being true is that someday our species might evolve to his level and kick his arse for all the crap he needlessly put us through. Then we could rescue all of his prisoners and create a REAL afterlife, where everyone is treated fairly instead of us imposing our morals on other people.
agree or disagree, theres my thoughts on an evolved god.
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 3:24 am
FutureAndAHope,
Your understanding of Evolutionary theory is laughable. Go read a book on the subject and you might understand something.
Also, I reject your premise "If you are an evolutionist you are actually stating it is possible that God does exist." because there are a multitude of religious evolutionary biologists.
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 4:37 am
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: I often hear the argument that it is illogical that God exists.
Yeah, I wonder why. 
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: However this is not the case, it is only the case if God is some how a magical force that created every thing from nothing.
Quite so. Particularly since it doesnt account for the infinite regress.
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: If you are an evolutionist you are actually stating it is possible that God does exist.
Before you can claim such a hypotheses you need to define God.
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: Evolution is a lower form taking on a higher form of complexity.
No it isn't. It means species changing over time to better adapt to changing climates and environments. There is no higher or lower complexity nessasserry, just what is better at surviving. Sometimes these species change to such an extent they can no longer breed with the ancestral species, that is how a new species evolves. It has nothing to do with growing in complexity, a species will only evolve into something more complex if the change is beneficial.
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: What if God evolved on a firey radioactive planet, or has evolved a higher state than our own by which he has mastered technologies capable of creating and destroying planets, and populating them at His own will.
Okay, why would you call that a god? And where would that god evolve from? All you did is move the goal posts.
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: To such an extent that he has enthroned himself as God.
So your god is an antfarm builder with an megalomaniacal ego complex?
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: He has discovered how to create life, even eternal beings. Beings he has subjected to His laws and will. A God who will not tolerate rebellion against his will, and will punish in eternal fire. A God who does not desire any one perish by such an act, but rather would have each one turn in surrender to his offer of eternal forgiveness.
Do as I say or die? I hate the bastard already. If you love your children that much you will not lock them in the basement for ever and ever because they were naughty one time. I would have social services over a parent like that like a rash on a psoriasis patient. I would say that person would be a sick sadistic individual that needs to be taken to a mental ward.
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: Forgiveness found only in the crucifiction of his own self, as an example of forgiveness; saying in prayer as an example for us "Father forgive them for they do not know what they are doing", as he was being nailed through. The just crucified for the and in-place of the unjust. A God who does what ever he sees fit with his things.
That a really weird way of getting stuff done, what ever happened to explaining the situation calmly and pointing out the problem with the behaviour you have a problem with. Children are very good at empathy, ask them how they would feel if something like stealing would happen to them and they will recognize that stealing is wrong. You don't need to threaten them with eternal punishment for that.
Having yourself nailed to the cross as some ultimate sacrifice when you know you are god and will not die but move to another plane of existence is no sacrifice at all, that is just theatrics. He is not going to die, for he is god, so what is the bloody point of this whole S&M sideshow?
Best regards,
Leo van Miert
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall --Torque is how far you take the wall with you
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 5:38 am
(January 12, 2009 at 10:08 pm)FutureAndAHope Wrote: If you are an evolutionist you are actually stating it is possible that God does exist. Evolution is a lower form taking on a higher form of complexity. What if God evolved on a firey radioactive planet, or has evolved a higher state than our own by which he has mastered technologies capable of creating and destroying planets, and populating them at His own will.
IOW your god is just an incredibly advanced being but nevertheless every bit as much of an entity of this universe as anyone else and thus no more right to be "God" than any other (ecpet by being the "biggest baddest bully" in the universal playground).
In essence this is the argument I heard from Michael Shermer (although I think it may originally be attributed to Arthur C. Clark) ...
" Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"
Big whoop!
Kyu
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 5:43 am
Beware of calling God mad, or some madness may overcome you, until you know God rules and he gives the earth to whomever he chooses.
I know God is real and wether he has always existed or had a beginning we are subjected to his will wether we like it or not. God is not going to change because we want it. He offers salvation to all who will seek it, but shows his wrath and great power against those who reject his offer. That is why I say people need to take my stories of God doing stuff more seriously. Your very lives are at eternal risk.
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 5:46 am
(This post was last modified: January 13, 2009 at 5:46 am by Kyuuketsuki.)
(January 13, 2009 at 5:43 am)FutureAndAHope Wrote: Beware of calling God mad, or some madness may overcome you, until you know God rules and he gives the earth to whomever he chooses.
God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad! God is mad!
Still here! Still sane! Sorry but saying that kind of thing is as stupid as your Wholly Babble.
(January 13, 2009 at 5:43 am)FutureAndAHope Wrote: I know God is real and wether he has always existed or had a beginning we are subjected to his will wether we like it or not. God is not going to change because we want it. He offers salvation to all who will seek it, but shows his wrath and great power against those who reject his offer. That is why I say people need to take my stories of God doing stuff more seriously. Your very lives are at eternal risk.
Yeah ... like frakk we are! Bored now!
Kyu
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 5:54 am
To quote a certain person:
“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”
I couldn't have phrased it better myself.
Your idea of a god is a nauseating piece of filth and I would not worship that lowlife for any threat you can throw at me.
Best regards,
Leo van Miert
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 8:42 am
(January 13, 2009 at 5:43 am)FutureAndAHope Wrote: Beware of calling God mad, or some madness may overcome you, until you know God rules and he gives the earth to whomever he chooses.
I know God is real and wether he has always existed or had a beginning we are subjected to his will wether we like it or not. God is not going to change because we want it. He offers salvation to all who will seek it, but shows his wrath and great power against those who reject his offer. That is why I say people need to take my stories of God doing stuff more seriously. Your very lives are at eternal risk.
God is a mad sadistic immature bastard. See? I'm still here.
No one will take your claims seriously without evidence.
I am not at risk because there is no god, there is no reason to think there is a god.
God is an idiot and a madman and threaterning me with eternal hell will only encourage me to insult this thing even more.
Never use fear as a motivational tool! It never works.
From my view of what I've been taught about religion. God lacks kindness, knowledge and wisdom and of course....he sucks.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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RE: What if God Evolved
January 13, 2009 at 8:50 am
(This post was last modified: January 13, 2009 at 8:50 am by Demonaura.)
Oh I see where this is going. If your god existed, which he/she/it does not. then your god would be a jerk, a dictator, a madman, a bully, a freakshow, a dominatrix, a liar and above all else the epitomy of everything I am glad I am NOT.
I recall saying a few tmes (not nessesarily here mind you) that even if god existed (and there was evidence) the only thing it would change is that I would beleive that god existed. And the only thing I would change in my life, is that I would search for a way to destroy that god.
Humans rule humans, we fought for what we have and hold. We survived the process of evolution, we developed the better traits and we fought our way to the top of this world. Now we develop our lives and society in reletive peach and control. Or at least we would is a bunch of us weren't borderline loonies spouting all this stuff about giant men in the sky that watch you pee and care about your sex life WAY too much to be normal. Seriously, gods a pervert.
EDIT: Heh, Ace, I'm gonna quote you "God lacks kindness, knowledge and wisdom and of course....he sucks. "
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