A thing about religious (and other) people and the illusion of free will

[ShinyCrystals]

Yeah, sorry.

I did say "more" objective, though, more meaning not completely because there are things in the human reality that are true. Many things, in fact.

Still, in terms of being more objective, I meant the reality outside of human reality has many things that, in terms of physical things, can't be refuted. Human reality has things that can't be refuted as well, but the actual reality of the reality outside human reality is different from how humans perceive things in the human reality. What might be perceived as true in the human reality, may not be true in the reality outside of human reality, or in the case of free will, may not exist in the reality outside human reality.

Free will does exist as a thing in the human reality. But does it exist in the reality outside that?

People here believe it does not exist, including me, but even with going by based on what I read here, it may be hard to say that free will does not really exist in the reality outside human reality. I am not sure if there is enough proof to debunk free will yet. There may be some evidence, but still...

So I was just stating a belief, therefore. I am saying this in terms of human reality rather than the one outside of it. Despite what may suggest otherwise, I don't think I was trying to pass off my point of view as a fact.

Can we have 5 examples of each ?

Alright.

For human reality...

Viewing the serious of a situation...
Believing in something that may or may not exist, and if it does, it may exist differently than what people believe (this includes believing in gods)...
Thinking that a turkey should be replaced as Thanksgiving dinner...
Favoring nuts over candy as a snack.
Interpreting something like love as something else than what it is, as viewed generally or by its actual definition.

Those are examples of human reality here, as in what is perceived and what people think of things. Now...

The reality outside human reality...

The planets orbiting the sun, which orbits the center of the milky way.
Apples being red.
Force equals mass times acceleration as determined by physics.
Sound not being something that travels in a vacuum.
A historic event or events like WWII happening the way they did...

Those are on the more factual, indisputable side of things, and in regards to free will, it may not exist as something as determined by the brain and neural system of the human body. My views, again, are on the human reality side, but I do think the brain and neural system of humans are more deterministic, or work in a way that does not allow for free will. I also just think many people, like those who are not scientists, do not seem to know more of how the mind works to determine if free will can actually work the way they believe it does. I am sure that when free will was first thought up by humans, they did not know much about the mind to determine that it does exist.